Josep Maria Saurí owns Can Terrades in La Batllòria, Sant Celoni, and is a reference in the sustainable management of Mediterranean forests. As a forester and livestock farmer, he continues a long family tradition dedicated to caring for the forests in the Montnegre and El Corredor Natural Park. He combines ancestral knowledge and innovation on his estate of more than two hundred and seven hectares to maintain a living and resilient landscape. With the help of his daughter Gemma, shepherd Clara Nadal and a flock of six hundred Ripollesa sheep and one hundred white Rasquera goats, he carries out an essential, but often invisible task: reducing the risk of fires through directed grazing. His work not only preserves the environment but also highlights the role of extensive livestock farming in the health of forest ecosystems.
 

The bleating of the Can Terrades sheep announces that the flock is ready to go out to graze in the forest. Josep Maria's whistle also indicates this. The animals are hungry and show signs of impatience. The shepherd, Clara Nadal, is already in place with her two dogs: Tro, a border collie, and Brisca, a Catalan sheepdog. At Can Terrades, the ground is muddy after days of heavy rainfall. From here, the treetops crowning the hills stand out against the sky like dark green umbrellas. While the livestock prepares to set out, Gemma Saurí, the likely successor at the helm of the project, adjusts the GPS devices on the sheep to locate them in case any get lost.

The diversification of the estate is one of the keys to the good work of Josep Maria's team. They combine direct sales of lamb from the flock—certified by the Catalan Council of Organic Agricultural Production (CCPAE)—with the extraction and marketing of cork, timber and other by-products. The timber also has PEFC (Programme for the Endorsement of Forest Certification) sustainable forest management certification. As an additional business line, they are finalising works to launch rural tourism accommodation.

Despite everyday obstacles, this family feels immense pride in continuing the legacy of forest stewardship. Josep Maria still remembers how his grandfather studied the evolution of potential fires with binoculars, in an era when there was a "fire culture". A philosophy that they are aware is being lost, although they welcome the fact that science is beginning to demonstrate that good forest management promotes biodiversity. The data prove them right, but they ask for more support, both from the administration and from civil society. To consumers, they pose a direct and clear question: "This month, how much lamb have you eaten?"

Josep Maria, you are the current owner of Can Terrades and continue the legacy of several generations. Where does your passion for forests and animals come from?

My mother's family already had sheep in Castelló, while my father's raised cows in Breda. I grew up surrounded by cows and, later, I decided to incorporate sheep and goats. My paternal grandfather was dedicated to forest management at Can Terrades, as did his grandfather and father, and so retrospectively until reaching the 12th century... It was a tradition. And it has come down to me, which is why I have continued. Somehow it's in my blood, although apart from this project, I have also worked in other areas.

At what point did you opt for a flock of sheep rather than other types of livestock?

It was a difficult bet. Currently, everyone chooses integrated livestock, but sheep and goats represent a challenge that I like. In theory, this model we have chosen is the future for protecting forests and establishing population in the territory. However, when I started in 1995, it was precisely the moment when most farmers were giving up. Everyone told me I would have no future, but the proof that they were wrong is that there are still flocks, and also people like Clara, who wants to be a shepherd.

You define yourself primarily as a forester, in a land that you feel is very much your own.

Absolutely. We have been managing the forests for many generations. We keep the property deeds from the year 1100 and something, which already record the taxes that were paid to the castle of Sant Martí de Montnegre for our land. In that era of barons, we were a kind of owner-slaves, because we had to pay taxes annually, a formula that did not end until the War of the Remences. Since that time, we have managed the forest.

At sixty-four years of age and with a lot of experience under your belt, what does this work still bring you?

I do this job because I like it. I have always carried it forward because it has fulfilled me. Taking care of a flock is like a drug. Economically it has its ups and downs, but surely, if there were no personal satisfaction, any other business would be more profitable. Forest management is a task that we have been carrying out in each generation and that maintains its continuity today. I am proud of that. It has drawbacks of all kinds, but it is a good job.

«Forest management is a task that we have been carrying out in each generation and that maintains its continuity today. I am proud of that» Josep Maria Saurí

The mountain that surrounds us has a lot of history. How would you explain the forest management that you develop?

We manage the forest as it was done in the past, following traditional methods. That is, we make selective cuttings and maintain an irregular forest, with trees of all ages. We also conserve the mixed forest, which means that cork oaks, holm oaks, oaks, stone pines and various other species coexist in the same forest. Every twenty-five years we carry out a thinning of trees: this way we keep the fuel in check, as the firefighters say.

Could you give us an example of this type of management?

As a preventive measure against fire, near the house we have created a protection strip that is integrated within the strategic management zone. I established this area with the advice of the firefighters, and it is a space where, in case of fire, the fire could be extinguished more easily thanks to the fact that the trees and shrubs are arranged with sufficient separation. All our interventions in the forest must be included in the Technical Forest Management and Improvement Plan approved by the Government of Catalonia, where we document forest planning actions. If there is any action that does not appear in the technical plan, we add it. There are areas where we can maintain the undergrowth with the flock, and others where it is not possible. It is necessary to determine in which areas we want to prevent fire from spreading or, at least, for it to be of low intensity. Doing it with the flock is natural and, incidentally, the sheep get fed! We try to make the forest structure as resistant as possible to forest fires, as fires worry us a lot. In Catalonia there are large abandoned forest masses, and this constitutes a serious problem.

According to the study by the Barcelona Agrària programme entitled “Fireproofed”, in sixty-two years (1956-2018) the number of municipalities in the province of Barcelona with an eminently forest landscape has gone from 104 to 193, which represents an increase of 84%. On the other hand, only 25% of the municipalities in the demarcation preserve a mosaic landscape. Although at Can Terrades you work in the opposite direction, aren't you worried that the abandonment of others will take its toll on you?

I have accepted it. Forest management began to be abandoned around the sixties and seventies due to the lack of economic profitability. The elderly used to say that a forest was dirty when it had a lot of undergrowth and warned that it would burn. And indeed, it did burn! Do we learn from these lessons?

There are also signs of hope. Some administrations, such as the Barcelona Provincial Council, value the importance of recovering the agroforestry mosaic. Do you feel that public and academic entities understand your work?

Yes, at least they are beginning to support the idea of traditional management! Technicians and scientists have begun to recognise the importance of managing forests, promoting the mosaic and, therefore, favouring pastures and open spaces within forests. This is already a lot, because before exactly the opposite was defended. We must pay attention to scholars, after all, because they are the ones who evaluate reality objectively. Thirty or forty years ago, the model that everything had to be forest predominated. And flocks were frowned upon because they maintained meadows and it was not convenient to have them. They had said it to my face! Now the situation has been reversed: they have carried out studies and have verified that the loss of biodiversity in forests is mainly due to the disappearance of open spaces. How things have changed! The recovery of the agroforestry mosaic is good news for biodiversity. For example, if we have fewer meadows, we have fewer butterflies, because the caterpillars breed there. They don't breed in the forest!

«Thirty or forty years ago, the model that everything had to be forest predominated. And flocks were frowned upon because they maintained meadows and it was not convenient to have them» Josep Maria Saurí

Another current of knowledge that would go against forest management is the so-called rewilding. What do you think?

Rewilding is a fiction that goes against the very history of rural soils. Here for ten thousand years, since the Neolithic, there have been pastures, forest management and agriculture, and now suddenly we want to emulate the Amazon or the boreal forests of Siberia. This desire to remove the human being from the ecosystem and return to a theoretical world I don't understand... Here forests have almost always been cultivated by people. When proper human management disappears, imbalances occur.

In this sense, it is necessary to differentiate between positive forest management and the harmful actions that we humans cause.
And one of these actions is fires. As you know, nature is regulated through disturbances. One of them is forest fires, but only 5% of fires are of natural origin; the other 95% is caused by inappropriate human activities: negligence, accidents or intentional acts.

In addition, the excessive frequency of fires prevents the forest from regenerating completely. The problem in Catalonia is that 70% of forests are not managed. Both cultivation and exploitation have been abandoned. In the face of climate change, a young forest that grows with competition between trees and without management represents a real time bomb.

«Only 5% of fires are of natural origin » Josep Maria Saurí

That's why silvopasture and flocks like yours are so important. Do you feel you are having success?

I don't know if I would talk about success, it would depend on the meaning we give it. The flock works, we have been going for twenty-seven years, but if you look around, the other shepherds have given up. Twenty years ago there was a flock of a thousand sheep nearby that made the transhumance to Montseny, and at least three more flocks grazed here. All of these have disappeared due to various factors: the low productivity of the sheep, the poor marketing of the products and the fact that people, in general, have prioritised buying the cheap product. If you look at it like this, the numbers don't add up in the extensive or semi-extensive system.

In addition, the habit of grazing in the forest is being lost because you need resistant breeds, which are native breeds capable of withstanding the conditions of grazing. Ours are Ripollesa sheep and, if you observe them, you will see that what they are eating now are rock roses! They also feed on gorse, which normally only goats eat. This is precisely the great value of these native breeds: they adapt to the territory, take advantage of what is available and help keep the forest clean. The other side of these breeds is that they are less productive: ours can give birth to one lamb a year and only 15-20% have two. For this reason, it is practically impossible to maintain the flock solely with the sale of meat. That's why the other flocks I knew have given up, have intensified or have changed the breed of sheep... There are the INRA, a synthetic breed, which give birth to three or four lambs. This is the line that is being implemented. In the case of lamb, since it cannot be intensified as much, the price has always been a bit higher than that of other meats.

Gemma, your daughter, is in charge of part of the direct sales. Do people value what you do?

Yes, they value us. In the end, what saves you is the quality of your product and the people who show you that they are willing to pay a little more to eat a type of meat that is raised naturally and does not contain chemical synthesis products. The question is that we keep going. Between the DUN subsidies from the European Union and the income from direct sales, we get by. The rest is anecdotal.

For forest management and fire prevention, do you receive public subsidies that allow you to be economically sustainable?

Yes, we receive economic subsidies, but they are of a reduced amount. We don't do forest management for the subsidy, but to prevent the mountain from burning, because if it burns we all lose. The aid represents about one hundred euros per hectare and is only for specific areas of the estate. We have also received financial support from the Barcelona Provincial Council. And as for technical support, we receive it mainly from the technician of the Association of Shepherds of Montnegre and El Corredor.

Any suggestions for the administrations?

They could look to the French model. There, with half a flock like ours, you can live with dignity. Here, with twice as many animals, we are about to give up. In France, they have substantial regional aid, while here we receive pittances. We have managed quite well: we do organic farming and direct sales. And this is what has saved us compared to other farmers. But the Administration should promote local produce and give more support to practices like ours, which is what neighbouring countries do.

«The Administration should promote local produce» Josep Maria Saurí

You are part of the pioneering initiative Ramats de Foc (Fire Flocks). What does it bring you?

We were already carrying out fire risk management tasks through grazing in strategic forest areas before joining this Pau Costa Foundation project. After creating the Association of Shepherds of Montnegre and El Corredor and when processing grazing permits, we discovered that Ramats de Foc was a project similar to ours. The difference is that we are specifically concentrated on this mountain, while they operate throughout the Catalan territory. In addition, they maintain a very good connection with the public administration. The Pau Costa Foundation is developing very valuable work.

Does being so linked to this specific territory give you advantages when it comes to preventing fires? Have you had to face any significant fires in recent years?

I can tell you about my experience when I was little. Before, people worked the mountain and many economic uses were made that, in turn, contributed to the maintenance of the forest. For example, my grandfather every day marked the trees that had to be thinned and determined the height of the cork oaks. All this practice was gradually lost around the sixties and seventies. With the lack of management, the forests became denser and the undergrowth began to proliferate. This process culminated between the eighties and nineties, and in 1994 there was a large fire, fortunately not here, but on the mountain opposite, from Gualba to Santa Coloma de Farners. Between eight and nine thousand hectares were burned. And it was precisely on estates where forest management was not done that the undergrowth burned with such intensity that it reached the tops of the trees. If people had studied that fire, they would have realised that in the grazed areas the percentage of dead trees was much lower. And it must be taken into account that there were few shepherds left, since most had been giving up. This clearly demonstrated that there was less fuel where grazing took place.

Despite current challenges, you are repositories of valuable agroecological and traditional knowledge. Do you feel that you know the mountain in a deeper way than other people?

What is clear is that we can provide a lot of information, but we often see that it is undervalued. From the offices they often propose ideas to us that we consider erroneous and that, when implemented, do not work. I think institutions should listen more to people from the rural world.

«We can provide a lot of information, but we often see that it is undervalued» Josep Maria Saurí

At Can Terrades your daughter Gemma could be the successor. Does it make you happy to know that she might continue writing the history of this place?

If it's possible, yes, I'm delighted. We'll see and we'll do what we can. Sometimes it's more the obstacles that are imposed on us externally than the intrinsic difficulties that determine whether an operation can continue or not. For example, now it has been decided to build an exit from the AP-7 motorway and that will make us lose the pastures of the Tordera river... These are situations that affect you. Society values having companies and jobs, while activities like ours have been forgotten. We will continue to manage the forests, and, as for the sheep, time will tell. If we receive external support, we will maintain them; if not, we will have to reduce the flock.

And meanwhile, is there any other project on the way?

We have an idea for the future that we have begun to materialise: we want to start an agritourism branch to diversify the activity. In the end, if you don't make breakfasts for the population that visits us from Barcelona, you don't make a living, ha, ha, ha! We are resisting as we can; in fact, we have spent two very difficult years with the drought. Now it seems that we can set the counter to zero. There came a point when I was about to sell the flock, to transfer it, but now I am clear that we will continue.

Original source of the interview: Municipal Forest Fire Prevention and Agricultural Development Technical Office from the Barcelona Provincial Council